I’ve been casually looking for a low-maintenance online game to play after completely leaving WoW behind, and LotRO is the first one to really intrigue me. Someone on some forum, somewhere, made a pretty insightful comment (paraphrased):

WoW tries to be too many things at once, and Blizzard is forced to balance PvP with PvE, which results in screwy game mechanics.

The poster then posits that since LotRO is very similar to WoW but primarily PvE-oriented, the game doesn’t need to balance each class against one another, nor is there the pressure of competition and keeping up with the Joneses etc. within the playerbase. (LotRO’s PvP apparently consists of players vs. player-controlled monsters, and I assume the monsters are provided as-is.) I can see this removing a lot of the drudgery of grinding, raiding, and competition from WoW, which in turn should alleviate the incidence of game addiction.

Honestly, I think that may someday be regarded as WoW’s biggest failure: truly balanced PvP has thus far only been found in online FPS and RTS games, where the only advantage that your time investment in the game gives you is familiarity–as it should be. RPGs, by nature, just don’t provide a level playing field, and attempts to force it lead to irritating nerfs and encourage the playerbase towards lootwhoring to overcome inconsistencies and disadvantages…which promotes grinding…which makes the playing field uneven…etc. Vicious cycle!

Truly balanced, fair, SKILL-based (instead of time-investment-based) PvP requires some arbitrary limitations imposed beforehand. This is not what RPGs are about. Mixing the two has resulted in WoW’s grindfest: PvE needs to be balanced for PvP which needs to be balanced for PvE which needs…ad infinitum. I find it really bizarre that Blizzard could on the one hand create Starcraft, a wonderfully balanced, skill-based, competitive online RTS, and on the other hand WoW, which attempts to merge balanced PvP with rewarding PvE and character progression etc., yet falls short of both.

I haven’t had my finger on the WoW “community’s” pulse since I quit, but judging from the deep frustrations I and other raider had already felt for a long time even THAT long ago, I believe your “melting” scenario is the most probable fate for WoW: those players who are most interested in real skill-based PvP will bleed off to Starcraft II, Team Fortress 2, and other FPS/RTS online games, while those interested in the classic RPG/PvE aspects will go to LotRO, Conan etc. once they burn out on WoW.

Regarding tribe mentality, I think part of WoW’s success lies in its novelty: this is the first MMO–indeed, sometimes even the first game, or at least non-console game–for many of its subscribers. In turn, these players have lost their innocence to WoW, and I don’t think they’ll swallow another glorified chatroom/grindfest so easily again, no matter how slick and polished. There is no reason that an online game cannot be more fun than work while retaining subscribers. Timesink/grindfest design is just the lazy way out, and I think WoW has milked the uninitiated fairly dry in that respect. MMORPG developers need to take a cue from Starcraft, Counterstrike etc. and figure out why balanced, gear-free (or close enough) PvP is so fun, as well as analyzing what makes RPG series from the Elder Scrolls’ complete open-endedness to Final Fantasy’s masterful linear storytelling so compelling.

Awesome site, btw.

But what I think is cool is how gamers DO seem to stick together - What is it about some groups that keeps them together through EQ, AC2, DAoC, SWG, WoW, etc?

WoW has pulled in a lot of players, but now that we’re all epic, socketed and getting tired of heroic instances, how much longer before something grabs us? Will WoW pull something new out of its sleeve, or will guilds like yours stick together?

There’s also friends - I’ve got a lot of awesome online friends on the servers I’ve played in, not just guildmates and RL friends. Can guildmasters take entire guilds to new games - or would it be easier if everyone played one big game again? Does it have to be another full-fledged WoW before people are going to make the effort? If so, WoW is probably going to have to melt off into a few other games first.

And what about single player games?

There’s a lot going on here, I really appreciated your comments Andy.

Over 2 years ov wow, some games have taken some of the players away , Oblivion, Lotr, Guild wars… but the players have not got the same excitement or enjoyment and have come back.

The down side of WoW has been the 10 man instances … While the 40 man raids of wow, before Burning crusade came out, broguht Guilds together, the 10 man system has split them up. The casual gamer has been left on the side lines to only enjoy a small amount of the new content.

ps, i found your site from PC gamer, June 07.